Volkswagen Eos Forum banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Good evening all,

I had run into what appears the somewhat common problem for my Eos of the battery draining and when the car charged back up, the computer was showing that it was a four door and the rear passenger window was reversed.

After some reading up and studying, I got a Vag-Com and was able to check my codes and, I THINK, set everything needed back to the two-door settings. However, this did not fix the problem with the window. Even upon running the rear window test on the Vag-Com, the window would only go down when the up action was used and up when the down action was used.

Upon reading through various possible solutions, I'm still not sure what a good fix to go with would be. After reading Voxmagna's post on changing out the rear window module, I'd like to avoid that option.

I've tried putting the key into the door and resetting the windows that way, but still no good.

Another option I've seen was to flash the firmware, but the nearest dealer is a little bit of a drive and I'd have to take time off work to go there, so I don't want to do that and then it not fix it.

Is there a way to fix it through Vag-Com? I've dug through the menus and looked around online, but I can't find anything.

For reference, these were the errors that came up on Vag-Com after I scanned. I cleared out the error codes, but they continued to rear their heads.

Address 72: Door, Rear Right Labels:. 1K0-959-704-GEN3.clb
Part No SW: 1Q0 959 704 A HW: 1Q0 959 704 A
Component: Tuer-SG 006 1203
Coding: 0000128
Shop #: WSC 48312 001 1012544
VCID: 35372631194F6DCF2A1-8060

4 Faults Found:
01554 - Motors for Central Locking; Rear Doors; Lock
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit - Intermittent
00931 - Locking Module for Central Locking; Rear Right (F223)
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
00938 - Switch for Electric Window; Rear Right (E54)
008 - Implausible Signal
00103 - Rear Right Interior Locking Button (E311)
008 - Implausible Signal

For comparison, here is the code for the rear driver's door, which works fine.

Address 62: Door, Rear Left Labels:. 1K0-959-703-GEN3.clb
Part No SW: 1Q0 959 703 A HW: 1Q0 959 703 A
Component: Tuer-SG 006 1203
Coding: 0000128
Shop #: WSC 00020 790 1012544
VCID: 34311B35123574C71DF-8060

No fault code found.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
Upon reading through various possible solutions, I'm still not sure what a good fix to go with would be. After reading Voxmagna's post on changing out the rear window module, I'd like to avoid that option.
Another option I've seen was to flash the firmware, but the nearest dealer is a little bit of a drive and I'd have to take time off work to go there, so I don't want to do that and then it not fix it.
As I said, after doing this job you don't want to go there unless you have to and a firmware reflash of the window control module via OBDII IS THE EASIEST AND CHEAPEST OPTION. My advice is pay for the dealer to try and fix it with a firmware re-flash and if they say it won't work and the control module needs replacing, decide if you want to DIY and follow my 'how to' or pay the dealer to do it. IMHO I wouldn't trust a general garage workshop to do it.

I do not think you will fix this with VAG-COM because I suspect your problem is the same as mine - corrupt module firmware! If you understand what I did to try to stop this happening again, I added protection components to the K-Line bus to reduce the risk of voltage spikes but 'brown out' failure of the module processor or memory caused by a slowly decreasing voltage from a discharging battery, is a failure in their module design which they should have foreseen. :( All modern car owners should consider replacing batteries every 3-4 years, use a tender 24/7 if their car is left for long periods, or disconnect the battery and store it on the garage shelf connected to a tender.

It is also worth checking if there is any abnormal parasitic current drain, although I wouldn't leave any battery connected for more than 4-5 weeks without driving the car or re-charging it. PS: NEVER attach a charger direct to the battery without first isolating the battery from the car by disconnecting the ground. Some may disagree and say they never had a problem, but the type of charger and 'Luck' is not something to rely on when there is so much electronic complexity to go wrong.
.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I figured the dealer would be the option. I took it too them when I first got the car to reset the computer to try and fix the issue and they told me they could not do it because I had the wrong J519 module installed in the car.

Something about the computer in it being for a 4-door car and the computer I needed was for a 2-door

VAG-COM is reading a 3C0 937 049 AJ and they were saying I needed 3C8 937 049 AC, which from what I've read, is not that much different, just newer and adds a few extra features.

I may be wrong, but from what I've read, I don't think that's the issue on my 2008 Eos, so I'm going to be a little annoyed if I take it back to them to flash the firmware and they say they can't do it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
VAG-COM is reading a 3C0 937 049 AJ and they were saying I needed 3C8 937 049 AC, which from what I've read, is not that much different, just newer and adds a few extra features.
There are many traps for the unwary my friend!. People buy and fit cheaper Chinese cloned control modules as replacements. Internally the Chinese modules can be 'emulators' with their own hardware circuit design and sold on Fleabay to be so called 'compatible'. I have taken some apart and compared them with genuine OE. They use single programmable array chips (cheap) and write software code to emulate the V.W module functions. In order to sell them as non genuine OE parts not stealing VW intellectual property, they have different hardware and change a letter or two in the first or last part of their code and hope the buyer won't notice the difference. :( But if you search for the EXACT same part number in a VW parts list you will not find it. :(

When something goes wrong, the V.W VAS equipment and image files that update firmware can only update their own genuine OE modules. Obviously, only their firmware code works in their module designs just as you would not expect MAC software to run on a Microsoft PC.

First you must establish if you have genuine V.W OE control modules or the clones I am suggesting? If you have a clone controller module which V.W (or anybody else) cannot reflash, you are on your own to decide whether or not to replace it and how to go about it.

You should NEVER regard these electronic control modules as 'similar'. As well as the part number if genuine V.W, the modules can contain different firmware versions for different V.W car variants. I already made this mistake buying used GOLF V controllers with 'K' part numbers. They will not work because EOS door and window controllers have different firmware inside for the roof interoperability.

If this problem related to another and easy to access controller, it would just be a nuisance to buy another cheap replacement Chinese emulating clone, but this location is really hard to access and work on where labor time could cost more than the module, even a genuine V.W. part.

If you want to search for a used part, only look at a genuine right or left from a V.W EOS of the same year as your car with each part digit matching from the V.W parts list for your year. An exception is V.W seem to have started selling one replacement EOS controller part which is backwards compatible for earlier years and that's what I bought for MY07. Whilst there might be a firmware version issue for some EOS model specs, at least V.W can sort it out with the correct firmware flash file matching your VIN.

Something about the computer in it being for a 4-door car and the computer I needed was for a 2-door
I have noticed in one of the module settings scanned by VAG-COM that there is an option to set whether a cabriolet or 'other' (4 door) vehicle, 4 door being the 'as new' supplied default, which is wrong for the EOS. I can't remember where it was, but search through all the module adaptation settings and see if it can be changed and stick? You would be a very lucky bunny if changing that option solved your problem (it didn't for me). I think most V.W Stealers could give you the run araound if you are asking them to fix system problems with Chinese modules fitted, when their diagnostics kit may be incompatible? You can be assured if they scan and find them, there may be a big red warning screen showing i.e don't touch this with a barge pole!

CAVEAT EMPTOR

Good Luck on your journey.
.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Yeah, I knew I was taking a gamble when I bought it. It had been totaled and now has a rebuilt title, but it had passed the North Carolina vehicle inspection after being rebuilt, which is a pretty strict inspection as far as US vehicle inspections go.

No engine, transmission, or large/expensive noticeable issues or noticeable frame damage when I got it and I got it for a great price.

My guess now is when it was being rebuilt a couple owners back, they added that module, but I'm not sure. I'll take a look and hope for the best.

Thanks for all the help!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
when I bought it. It had been totaled and now has a rebuilt title
Johny cash sang a song called 'One piece at a time' which is reminiscent! :)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Piece_at_a_Time

Sounds like you need to find out what your EOS really is, how much is V.W and how much is aftermarket or Chinese? Rebuilding any V.W EOS back to factory spec. would write off the car, unless an insurance company had deep pockets? You can guess that corners will have been cut to maximize profit on the re-sale. :( Still, if you bought it really cheap and have to spend on it, that's the bullet you now have to bite. But main dealers with the technical knowledge will want to replace any iffy parts with genuine V.W to make sure your car is properly repaired and guaranteed. That long trip to the Dealer, time off work and a hotel stopover may still be your cheapest and best solution? Forum members here tend to assume an EOS is stock when helping with problems and customizations can make problem solutions more difficult to find.

IMHO I would still log all the electronic modules scanned by VAG-COM, check the module codes and firmware carefully, then do what I could to get the clones replaced with genuine new or used from an EOS the same year if you only have 1 or 2. Although, there is never a guarantee used parts aren't faulty as the wreckers can't test before sale. V.W generally put a physical date code on their parts, I don't think this comes through with VAG-COM but you should be suspicious if parts are a lot newer or older than your car by more than a year, or most don't have the '1F' code in the part number, which is EOS specific. You can do this date check on most of their plastic parts too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,014 Posts
A quick check of my usual source shows that 3C0 937 049 AJ is a Chinese part - but not in the way you might think! That part is only applicable to the VW Sagitar sold in China.

As well as Eos-specific 1Qx parts, there are some components that are standardised and taken from the Golf V (1Kx) or Passat B6 (3Cx) but as voxmagna says, they may not be correct. If in doubt you can check the applicability of parts on the link at the top of the post.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
This whole electronic cloned parts thing is a nightmare. It's even a nightmare with genuine V.W parts (when they really are?) because V.W have many variations for firmware code inside that has to match your VIN build. And as many know, software code defines the product more than the physical parts.

If I had a suspect part that had a listed V.W number on it and looked like the real thing, I don't think I could trust it unless I knew it had come from a V.W dealer, their parts network distributor, or looked grubby and came from a doner car the same year. Imagine buying an airbag, steering or ABS controller which scanned with no faults, gave no dash faults, but failed to work on that one occasion it needed to save your life? :eek:

A couple of years ago I read some vehicle manufacturers (Merc?) were going to use special codes in their electronic modules so only dealers would be able to install a replacement. This involved diagnostics access to the ECU to update a secure data table of all the modules registered to the vehicle VIN.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts
When I first purchased my Eos I installed an onboard battery charger/maintainer and remote battery voltage reporting and engine starting. These systems get used often and contribute greatly to the reliability and convenience of the car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
I have a Euro style accessory socket with sprung weatherproof cover permanently fitted and wired (with protection) to the battery. My mains charger inside the house is a laptop power supply connected to an Ebay voltage converter/switcher board adjusted for constant charge current and voltage, Cheap as chips to do. :) I used the jack connector because if I forget to disconnect it, it pulls out and there's only safe low voltage on the long wire.

At each service for all my vehicles I load test the battery and measure it's internal resistance to compare with new and all previous measurements. I always buy the biggest and cheapest max. cranking current battery I can get into the battery carrier, which is always larger than V.W OE.

Problems with EOS and other car electrics can arise just disconnecting and reconnecting batteries, but there are 'maintainers' you can connect before disconnecting the battery. All this saves a lot of grief, frustration and expense. :cool:
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Thanks for all the insight!!

So I've got the idea to go to the nearest pull-a-part and buy a used computer off of a passat, rabbit, or preferably golf (I am under the impression that the golf is the closest to the eos design-wise and thought I read somewhere that they used the same control module) and recode it to my eos. My issue now is just finding where the right control module is on my car. I( thought it was behind the glove box, but after removing that all I saw was the comfort control module.

Any idea on where the main control module is located?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
I don't think that will work. This thread should have told you that the EOS is the only car in the V.W range with a cabriolet roof and many control modules have bespoke functions for the roof system not required for other models, which is why electronic module part codes and ancilliary codes for firmware versions (many) they are programmed with are important. You may think a control module has nothing to do with the roof but that is probably a wrong assumption. Those EOS bespoke functions are in firmware code and unless you are proposing to find a hex image file of the correct firmware for your EOS VIN and burn it into a Jetta or 'something else' module (assuming the module hardware design is the same?), I doubt you will find them compatible.

Tear open an old or broken V.W electronic module some time and have a look inside.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
This is what has me confused though, I go to Volkswagen's site, and they say this module is for all the highlighted models. If that's the case, I would think all the necessary modules are there, I'd just need to get the dealer to either reset for Eos, or flash the Eos specific firmware.

I figured I'd run into some issues with it being pulled from another car, but wouldn't all the necessary modules and ports would be if it's able to be used across multiple cars?
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,014 Posts
As bizarre as it may seem, that is the right part according to ETKA (including the letters). I would hope that it is safe to assume that VW would provide different part numbers if different firmware were required for different cars, and that coding should be all that is required.

Pull one from an Eos and you shouldn't need to do any coding; pull one from a different model and you may need to do some coding in VCDS but it should work as far as I can see.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
I ran an older version of the V.W parts list until it expired. V.W use a sequence of single letter codes and they would be specific for MY07 year, other years would have a different code. Then updated parts started coming out with another letter change showing wider 'backwards' compatibility with years including mine to present day.

That made me think they could have taken a sensible approach to make new parts 'one size fits all'. However, this doesn't help if you are getting used parts from doner cars, only if you buy a brand new genuine electronic module from V.W with their latest (and last) code letter and you won't find those from the Chinese sellers!

If you visit the various parts sites hosting the latest version of ETKA, you wouldn't spot this because only the latest backwards compatible parts are shown. I bought a rear window motor and controller which had the same part code EXCEPT the last letter. It worked but had no roof integrated function. VCDS did nothing. I finally forked out for the dealer supplied part which had some physical differences, info on a wiring patch to do and a later parts letter. ETKA listed this part as suitable for ALL earlier EOS models.

If you find something from another VW model that works for you then great, :) but unless it is the newest dealer supplied part, don't assume it will be EOS compatible. Another issue that catches you out is these modules talk to others in the car system. You may have something claimed to work in an EOS, but there's no guarantee it will be compatible with existing controllers in your car. Dealer workshops may meet this with their own genuine replacement parts, but they have the software tools to reflash and update other older module firmware.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
So I FINALLY got the computer replaced. All the windows are working like they're supposed to. I put the top down and everything seems to be going fine. I put the top up, there's a pop, and the passenger side does not line up with the windshield and is loose...Yay...I'm able to hold in position and get the top back in place, but then the sunroof won't close. So I start taking it apart to see what's going on and a piece has broken (seen below). There's is also a strip of metal that looks like it should screw in somewhere that's been bent to the side between where the front and rear portions of the track for the sunroof meet up (location shown below as well). It looked like it slotted in to the side of the rail closest to the body, but had come out and bent in such a way that it was blocking the sunroof from closing.

I have no idea what this piece is and the exploded views I look up only gave less than detailed drawings to identify the piece. Does anybody know what this is so I can get a new one?
22299

22300

22301
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
I think you have the problem a couple of others have had with their sunroof tracks or the 'swing out' of the right & left side members.

You start by moving the headlining back to expose the running tracks when you can compare each side. You may have to dig further by removing the painted side members. Since I've recently been there, you do NOT want to attempt this without the shop manual for reference and it WILL blow your mind.

Both roof side member rams move the side members an equal amount until their location spigots align with holes in the A frames and the locks come on. If you say one side member was coming out short, that suggests it was meeting an obstruction until you heard the 'crack'.

This is unlikely to be a quick fix, assuming you can replace broken parts and is very technical on measurement and alignment after removing and replacing any parts in the hinge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Does anyone know which Computer patrickgrae replaced to get this sorted?
My 2007 is identically confused. Was is that 3C8937049AC gateway?

Please help.
Mark
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,819 Posts
Why mess about shooting in the dark and replacing modules which may not work, even when symptoms appear the same? Surely it's much easier to search, read posts and try to clear/reset all the module memories first with a battery disconnect as has already been described?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
I've been studying this phenomenon since my eos grew rear doors last fall and I want to understand the root cause failure. The consensus on ross-tech.com forums is that it is not a long coding deviation but a change in the actual firmware running on some module. Thus the only fix is through the stealership where they can flash the firmware anew, possibly replacing a module if it suffered actual hardware failure. Given the prevalence of this problem (even some GTIs have become 4-doors), I believe it is a design weakness by VW.
I believe the Dealers should not profit off customer pain but should go to corporate for compensation, as in a class action suit.
I'm currently looking for a cheap, high mileage 2007 eos with a working roof to aid in side by side evaluation to solve this.
I'm a retired electronics engineer from Bell Labs in New Jesrey. Also kinda stuck at home, so....

Any information is useful.
Thanks
Mark Slaughter
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top