EOS cluster stores immobilizer data, also the plug is different. Old style is 36-pin and new one is 32. Here is the adapter. https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256802611933224.html
In order to transfer immobilizer data you will need SVCI or VVDI. You can PM me with questions on immo data transfer. I have done similar conversions on multiple vehicles.
You can definitely swap the gateway, BCM if it is higher trim level and you plan future upgrades.

 

The 2012 is a Lux version with backup sensors, nav, push button start, and steering wheel controls. Would be sweet to swap everything over to older car, but I assume would be a lot of work.

 

Yes, it is a lot of work, but having a parts car makes it so much easier. If you have a place to park 2 cars side by side you can keep your existing wiring harness and transfer over just the parts you want. You will be a third way there since you are planning interior swap. You have to have a scan tool for a successful swap though. VCDS is a really good option for most of the things. All of the wanted swaps can be done. I can write up short versions of what is involved in swap of each of the systems if you would like.

 

I may actually attempt to swap most things over if I don't have to replace the full harness. I do have access to VCDS, but for the cluster I don't know anyone with SVCI or VVDI.

I am doing a bathroom renovation currently so just making plans now for the parts car.

 

I struggled with the immo. problem without a solution I felt confident trying without bricking the car. I have a used working Golf V diesel white full height mfd display and my original red split display with bottom fade. I managed to get hex dumps from each eeprom, but stopped short when I couldn't find the immo factory code you need to use VCDS (You will know what I mean!). I have thought of immo.deleting the ECU, but that leaves you with a tell tale warning dash message at each key on.

For this OP, one easy thing that might work is swapping both instrument clocks AND ECU if the engines in each car are the same? However the car would have the personality (and mileage!) of the other car

 

The engines are both 2.0T, but are not the same. The newer car has extra emissions parts so the ECU would be unhappy in my older car.

 

You will need auto-scans of both cars to plan any swaps.

I believe that headliners are the same. The part that covers sunroof has a solid front part and soft rear part.

 

With these cars and the EOS being the only cabriolet, most of the 'mechanicals' should be the same, but electronic module compatibility will be where you may get swap problems?

On older cars the newer module firmware isn't always backward compatible. Many who install new radios discover this and have to replace their Gateway module or get the original reflashed by a dealer. Dealers who install genuine (i.e expensive) infotainment upgrades will have service instructions that require older modules in the car to be checked and firmware upgraded by reflash to make the 'System' compatible with their later parts. This isn't always an option for DIYers who don't have access to V.Ws firmware library. I tend to play safe replacing a faulty module with one used of the same year, part code and firmware.

How different are the headliners? I noticed the 2012 had a solid cover that slides forward to cover sunroof.

That's interesting and I don't know how they would do that because MY07 soft cover on the shade has to fold concertina fashion to fit in the narrow space underneath the steel panel?

 

Volkswagen vehicles are like Lego's but for adult "kids") Modules can be quite easily programmed from one car to another with vcds, odis or vcp.
Any VW enthusiast should invest in some equipment.
It is possible to install newer style radio like Composition Media or Discover Media to older cars. Yes, it will require changing the gateway, but it is quite easy with vcds.
It is not economically viable to go to a dealer with this older cars.
Headliner has a sold front part and soft middle that allows it to fold. I got a new headliner for my car from 2008 in much better shape than mine. I did not install it yet, but plan to do that soon.

 

VCDS (and OBDII) only does adaptation to existing module firmware at high level and won't reflash new firmware for other versions. If you try invoking an adaptation or long code using VCDS you can get an error message if the long code is considered 'Out of range' for the module firmware. If you have a door or window controller from a Golf etc, you can't use it in an EOS even with VCDS adaptation because firmware used for the EOS modules has additional code to support its roof operation.

If you have access to V.Ws firmware binary library and know what each version does (?), you can use ODIS with the right engineering access code to reflash a new binary upgrade. When a dealer uses ODIS it links online to V.Ws online file library and vehicle VIN database to search and locate the correct files with their upgrades. All EOS modules carry a part ID, but they are also labelled with their firmware version.

Have you gone beyond normal diagnostics coding adaption yet and reflashed an EOS module with updated firmware, or tried using a Golf 'K' door module in an EOS? IMHO Golf and Passat modules are more generic as are their modules for 4 door cars. Certain EOS electronic modules have their design roots in the same cars but EOS firmware is module part specific?

The Gateway issue affecting new radio installs on older EOSs has come up several times here and the answer is given on the Ross-Tech VCDS wiki: You have to use modules with later firmware and older gateway modules can't be easily adapted using VCDS. A dealer can update certain older EOS Gateway modules with a binary file reflash (That's not adaptation!) and others require a new Gateway module, which I suspect is changed hardware.

Chinese so called cheap 'clones' have a larger user base for Golfs and Passats but aren't what you think they are inside, although the boxes externally look the same. Genuine OE parts use discrete chips and processors whereas Chinese versions aren't actual copies infringing V.W copyright. If you check every single digit in a Chinese version part you find one digit different which is not listed in V.Ws parts database. They use different more universal hardware and software emulation to replicate genuine modules. Their compatibility, performance and speed compared to OE is only as good as their software and reverse engineering.

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Navigation_System_(RNS510)_Retrofitting

 

Some modules are same across a lot of models: ecm, tcm, gateway, steering control module, power steering, Bluetooth, radio etc. Some modules are exclusive like roof control module or easy entry.
Yes, some modules can be reflashed with odis or vcp. There are plenty of websites where it is possible to download newer versions of the firmware. In some cases new firmware makes things worse and since original firmware not available, the module have to be replaced. Ask me how I know
It is quite easy and not to expensive to install 7N0 gateway into eos, since it is PQ35 platform. You can install "full" gateway that supports extended can so more retrofits are available.

 

I have a Chinese Gateway module with extended adaptation options. I know from its large single chip inside it's design is based on software emulation. Unfortunately it doesn't send the correct EOS system 'go to sleep' commands leaving the CANbus open and causing battery drain.

There are thousands of V.W binary firmware files for their modules and ECUs. What matters most is access to a search engine that selects which firmware file versions are vehicle and system compatible and which other modules may need their firmware updated or modules replaced. The Ross-Tech wiki has some useful information gathered from others on certain module compatibilities. It's a pretty good source for steering module information. Just look at the plethora of modules by year, part number, firmware and firmware versions to choose from.

Dealers use their online database access to order replacement electronic modules for workshops so they don't have to work out anything for themselves. A genuine replacement module may come with a service instruction flagging this up, or it's written into an updated service procedure. Module firmware is hardware specific. If they add or change IO functions to a module it's unlikely to be 'Upgradeable' or guaranteed to be backwards compatible. If that module is replaced, it's affect on others in the system has to be considered.

The worst you can do playing around with firmware flashing is brick the module, particularly if you don't have the original binary image to go back to.

 

So worst case can I pull all the wiring and modules from the newer car and swap everything into my older car and have everything work? It sounds like a ridiculous amount of effort, but I am thinking it is always an option as long as I could leave the engine wiring and ECU alone.

 

You cannot replace everything but ECU and have a working car. ECU will conflict with immobilizer that resides in cluster.
Let's begin with 2 things:
1) Auto-Scan of both cars
2) List of systems from newer car you would like to transfer over.

In one of your previous post you mentioned couple things:
A) Cluster
B) backup sensors
C) nav
D) push button start
E) steering wheel controls

A) Cluster is a part of the immobilizer system. In order to swap cluster you need to have locksmith transfer your car's immobilizer data to a new car. You will need to splice in wiring from old style 36-pin into new style 32-pin. You can also purchase SVCI 2020 and learn how to use it. I can transfer immo data for you, but it will require shipping a bunch of modules to me.
B) Backup sensors. There are multiple configurations of this system. System 1 - 4 sensors on the back, System 2 - 8 sensors (4 front, 4 rear), 12 sensors system with parking assistant. For 4 or 8 sensors system you will need wiring from each sensor to a control module, beeper speaker(s) and gateway from 2012 car. For 12 sensor system you will need sensors, brackets to mount sensors, hole punch tool, wiring, most likely new ABS sensors for rear wheels, ABS unit and lot's of programming. Some systems are easier to install then others, but all is doable.
C) Most likely it has RNS-510 navigation unit. It will have massively outdated maps. Will need to transfer the unit itself, run a wire to the trunk cover and swap over antenna. Most likely will need to purchase unlock code for about $10.
D) push button start is called kessy. Following are components of the system: cluster, kessy module above brake pedal, kessy antennas inside and in the rear bumper, door handles, elv (steering lock). Immobilizer data needs to be changed in some modules for everything to work in your car and with your ECU.
E) steering wheel controls will work if you swap steering control module. It will also depend on what power steering control module you have in your older car.

Let's address your idea of swapping everything but ECU. At this point without auto-scan it might be a moot point. In 2009 2 kinds of 2.0 engines were used: CCTA and CBFA. In 2012 same 2 kinds were used as well. In the case where 2 engines are the same code ecu from the 2012 car will work with 2009 engine. It might require some tweaks or coding, but it might work.
It is possible to swap everything and keep your existing ECU, but you will need to ship ECU to do immo-delete on it. You will also have a vin mismatch, because all other modules from newer car will have it's original vin in it. In a nutshell - you will have a car with incorrect vin.

It makes sense to go with a project of this magnitude if your 2009 car is in a very good condition mechanically and exterior-wise and you intend to keep it for a long time. Or you like to tinker and learn new stuff

 

That's very helpful. Have you had immo. delete done and stopped the tell tale dash warning at key on? Would it be correct to say if you get ECU immo. delete done first, you have no further issues with Cluster immo. apart from the cabling? Immo. delete doesn't need a locksmith and is doable with Alientech tools.

 

I do not have experience with immo delete. I just know that it can be done.
I wanted the MFA+ cluster in MK5 jetta. There was one gentleman who quoted me about $300 labor+shipping. He also quoted me $50 for additional key. I decided to buy svci instead. I spent about same amount, but gained experience.
I got a MFA+ cluster from Tiguan (they are cheap) and played with it. Everything worked after some trial and error. Later I just needed to move few resistors to get rid of error related to mechanical parking brake.
You need to be aware that abs coding is erased when cluster with different vin or after service mode is plugged in. Coding needs to be restored and g85 needs to be adapted.
Imho replacing cluster with proper tools is better solution than immo delete in ecm.

 

I do not have experience with immo delete. I just know that it can be done.

Neither do I, but everything I've read says you get a tell tale dash warning after every key on telling drivers immo. has been de-activated. I've not found a fix for it but I bet it's coming from the ECU. I won't be trying it on my in-situ ECU because I want to keep driving the car. I do have a spare non-tri core ECU I can play with first.

My route will be immo. delete on the second ECU, then hook up the clocks and see what I get? If I wanted to get really enthusiastic, I'd hook up a Gateway module and connect the CAN lines. I once thought it possible to synthesis an ECU on the bench with all the IO voltages and outputs to loads, feedback and with a pulse signal gen. on the crank sensor input. Somebody has already had a go at that to investigate ECU fuelling maps and boost mods.

A wasn't aware of the ABS coding being wiped? As long as it's recoverable with VCDS using the original VCDS adaption settings I'm O.K with that. I have replaced the ABS unit and it swallowed the original adaptation coding. I've learned the hard way these modules aren't always predictable. I'm lucky I have a 2007 with early pre tri-core ECU. I think modules in newer EOSs may not behave the same or need more advanced (expensive) software tools.

 

I have had zero time to mess with cars as I have been working on the house every free minute I get.

As I have lots of time during my day job to think about what I want to do with the car, I came up with another idea. I am thinking about selling the 2009 Eos and finding a non-running 2012 Eos to swap everything over. I am seeing most auction cars are Komfort, so I would still want all of the Up-model parts off my donor 2012 car.

Would I be on the right track for getting the same model year to make the parts swap easier? Only thing I can think of that would be an issue is the electronics would have a different VIN from the chassis. Would there be a way to change the VIN? They scan the car electronically every 2 years for emissions so not sure what info they would see.

 

Curious, why do they scan the car for emissions, there is no data that says what has been emitted and how much? In U.K they stick a sensor in the exhaust and use their garage test kit. The VIN data is embedded in the ECU. Tuners can clone an ECU so I assume the VIN is transferred from the doner ECU, try asking a tuning shop? You also have the odo mileage stored in the ECU. You can do so much advance planning, but eventually it comes down to what you have to work with and problems morphing 2 cars into one. IMHO if you get a later car with more features you try to use what you have to get that better car working? From 2008 onwards V.W were bringing out different engine versions to reduce emissions. In UK our cars are classified from new according to manufacturers emissions statements for that model year and annual tests, measured against that benchmark. If I put an older engine type into a newer car that had significant engine changes to reduce emissions, my car would not pass test thresholds set for exhaust gases. If you have the same, check if the engine type codes and stated emissions levels are the same for engines you want to swap? Some countries may allow 'Special Custom Builds' to be registered as new type, but it's a process fraught with hurdles to satisfy certification and red tape. Good Luck with your project.

 

Here in Arizona (and many other states) on 96 and newer cars, they use the cars On Board Diagnostics for the emissions test. A Check Engine Light for anything is an automatic failure. They also check the ECU readiness section to ensure a minimum of 6 (or 7?) of the 8 readiness tests have passed. These consist of Evap, Oxygen sensor heaters, Exhaust readings, etc.

On pre-96 cars they put them on the rollers with a sniffer in the tailpipe.

 

Thanks that's enlightening with less problems for you. As long as the ECU + engine + its emissions anciliaries are working and match (whatever year they are after '96), they are happy, even though they are not actually sniffing what is in exhaust gases at the tail pipe? That puzzles me because O2 sensors are measuring depleted Oxygen not gases coming out after combustion. The EVAP result being a much smaller polluter is only whether the tank is sealed or not.

I could play devils advocate then and say older V.W engine types with their matched ECUs are a better swap because they have fewer added emissions controls, are less complex, more reliable, lighter and with better performance and gas mileage. Year on year post 2007 V.W were continually modifying their engines adding more complexity to comply with changing EU rules for emissions at the tail pipe and gas tank. The last engine type used in the EOS was a lot more complex to meet stricter Euro 6 rules, than an earlier engine in a 2007 meeting Euro 4. Do your registration document state the emissions per mile? U.K vehicles do and that's what U.K taxation system and vehicle testers base their tests on. An older vehicle engine will be allowed higher emissions per mile and will be tested to a less stringent level but taxed more. You could find a V6 engined EOS then, add on a turbo mod. and as long as diagnostics readiness tests passed, you would be good to go! I found this link:

OBD2 Readiness Monitors Explained

Learn everything about Readiness Monitors

www.obdautodoctor.com